Nothing Is Free: A Hungarian Refugee's Warning to Young Americans | Agnes Gibboney

[00:00:14] Welcome to The Jenny Beth Show. Today we have a communist survivor joining us for our Surviving Communism series, Agnes Gibboney. Thank you so much for joining me. Thank you for having me. So Agnes, you were born in Budapest in Hungary, correct? Correct. And you were born about 10 years or so after communism really got going. Is that correct? That's correct.

[00:00:40] So what was it like for you? I know you were a small child when you left, so we'll get to that. But what was it like for your parents as that transition happened in becoming communism? I'm sure they've talked to you a lot about it. Oh, that was the topic of every Hungarian when they got together. How difficult it was, how you were so suppressed you couldn't speak.

[00:01:05] You were afraid to talk to even your siblings about communism or being against it because somebody would report you and the police would come and take you. No trial, no hearing, nothing. Forced labor camp, that is, if they didn't execute you. It was very stressful and it was almost like everybody was telling the same story how difficult it was.

[00:01:29] So being afraid to even speak to family members, that is something I don't – we hear people who say, oh, I talked to my family or my family canceled me or my friends canceled me. What you're describing is something next level from what most Americans can even think of. On a totally different level.

[00:01:48] So just imagine when I went to Hungary for the very first time in 1977, I was not yet – we were living in the United States as legal residents, permanent residents, but I was not a citizen yet. So I had to apply for a white passport, which is a one-time re-entry passport to come back into the United States.

[00:02:09] So we went – I went to Hungary for the very first time to meet my extended family because I grew up without knowing my aunts and cousins, nobody. We knew nobody or grandparents. And I remember going to my uncle's house and I said, how is it over here, you know, with communism? And he goes, shh, shh. And I – what did I do? And he said, we can't talk.

[00:02:38] The neighbors will hear and they can report you and you get arrested. And I'm thinking, oh, my God, I cannot imagine living in fear 24-7 that you have to walk a straight line and watch every word which you say in fear of just getting arrested. Yeah.

[00:02:58] It's just – I just – you know, to me, coming from a free country because I grew up in Brazil and now living in the United States and going to Hungary, it was just such a different lifestyle and so gloomy, so gray. It was just so depressing. And I would look at people walking in the street. Nobody had a smile on their faces. Everybody looked so depressed, so drained and stressed.

[00:03:27] And I'm thinking, this has got to be hell to live here, you know, even though that's my country of birth. But I thought, I don't want to live here. In fact, I told my mother, I said, because of my re-enter permit passport, it said stateless. I was stateless because Hungarian government took our citizenship away. So when we immigrated to Brazil, we were stateless. Immigrated to the United States, I was stateless.

[00:03:56] And that's when I found out when I applied for that passport what stateless meant. But she said, do you have a Hungarian passport? What's your nationality? I said, Hungarian. Where's your Hungarian passport? And I don't have one. And she looked in the computer and she goes, that's because you're stateless and ripped the passport. And I thought, what is stateless? It says, you don't belong anywhere. That's what I was told at the INS building in downtown LA. I don't belong anywhere.

[00:04:26] That was very hard to hear. I can imagine that it was. So you, how did your, you left very young. You were two. Two. Right? So you don't, it would be very difficult to remember what happened then. How did your family get out? And who left with you? It was my father, my mother, my brother, myself.

[00:04:51] This is two months after because the Soviet Union invaded our country in October of 1956. That's when the revolution broke out too, that people were protesting. And my father and my mother decided that they were going to leave. And none of my mother's siblings or my father's siblings or parents knew that we were going to be splitting. So we left with a suitcase.

[00:05:17] It was my father, my mother, my brother, who's three and a half years older than I was, and myself, and another couple, a friend of my parents. But what happened, they took a train to the very last train station. And from there, they had to walk the rest of the way. And I woke up in the middle of nowhere and I started crying. And the soldiers heard.

[00:05:43] And they surrounded us, six, and took everything away, the suitcases, because my parents had a suitcase filled with cigarettes that they were going to sell abroad to make some money to have some food to live on. They took all their belongings, their suitcases, everything, but did not arrest us. So the following month in January, my parents went for the border again.

[00:06:09] But this time, through the help of my mother's friend who worked in a pharmacy, they concocted something for me to sleep through the journey. And this was the last day that the border into former Yugoslavia was open. So that's where they crossed, jumping over a very deep white ditch, helping the woman, the two women. And one jumped with my brother and my father jumped with me

[00:06:38] and came to a house in Yugoslavia. And they said, we're going to take you to like equivalent of Red Cross. I'm not exactly sure, but like a Red Cross. And then we went to a refugee camp. Wow. And was Yugoslavia free? Yes. Yes. A lot of people were fleeing either to Austria or to Yugoslavia. But Austria border was closed. So there was no way to go there. So we had to go towards Yugoslavia.

[00:07:09] It sounds like what we would see in a movie. Like this is the kind of thing that would be in a movie. They go, they get in a train, they have a seat for the cigarettes, they have their baby and then they don't make it. Yeah. And then they go back and it's the very last possible day before it gets clamped out. Thank goodness they made it out. Thank God. And soon after that, my mother found out she was pregnant and gave birth to my baby brother, Yedranco, in Yugoslavia.

[00:07:38] But they wouldn't let my mother leave to take him to the hospital for whatever reason. And finally, when they realized that there was a problem with the baby, they allowed my mother to take him, not my father. He had to stay in the refugee camp with my brother and I. So my mother went to the hospital with my baby brother and they were admitting him as he died in her arms. Oh, no. Yeah. Wow. So my parents had a very difficult life.

[00:08:07] My brother was the first one. He was very preemie. I think he was like nine weeks premature. My mother said he fit in a shoebox. And in those days, in 1951, there was no incubators and, you know, the technology that they have nowadays. But my brother survived. And after that, we had a little sister, Martha. She was five and a half months when she passed. She had rickets, probably from lack of nutrition.

[00:08:36] That's a bone disease, something. So she died at five and a half months. And I didn't learn about her for many years after. I was an adult when I learned about my, actually in 77 when I went to Hungary, I told my mother I wanted to visit my grandparents' grave, her parents. They were both deceased at the time. And she says, visit your sister. And I said, what? What sister? And she goes, Martha.

[00:09:00] So I ended up redoing her grave because all it was is a wooden cross with a plaque that said Martha Staley. Her ashes lay here, lived five and a half months. And I had the whole thing cemented and redone for my parents. But I asked permission first if I could do that. And my mother said, she nodded, yeah, but choking her tears.

[00:09:29] And I was very honored to do that. In fact, my husband said, just take the money out of our account. And I said, no, I have to earn this. So I babysat while I took care of my kids so I could earn that money. So I can say I paid for that. Oh, wow. And then came me. And, of course, in Yugoslavia, my baby brother, Yedranco, passed.

[00:09:54] And when we immigrated to Brazil, my mother had another little girl, Clara. And I remember a little baby. And my mother said, don't bother her. Don't bother her. She's not ours. They're going to come and take her. And she died of meningitis at 24 days old. Wow. Yeah. So my parents had a very, very difficult life. Very difficult life.

[00:10:20] But they were willing to risk everything to make sure you and your brother did not live in communism. Did they know what was coming? Yes. What prompted them to, what was going on that made them realize they had to get out? I think because my father, they never, I drilled my parents too many times about that. What did he do? Did he kill somebody or did he do something? None of that because my family had investigated that, make sure that there was nothing like that.

[00:10:50] But my father was anti-communism and he was speaking up too much. And they were afraid that he was going to get arrested and taken to a forced labor camp. So they had to get out. They had to get out for their survival.

[00:11:06] And imagine leaving all your family behind, your friends, everything you've ever known, your belongings, everything, and just living with one suitcase to a country that you don't speak the language you know nobody. It's like thrown into another planet. But that's where I grew up in Brazil.

[00:11:35] We lived there 13 years, applied twice, and both of those, the application lapsed. And the third time we were successful, actually by a guy coming, knocking on our door, saying, is your mom home? And I said, no. I said, please tell her she needs to go to the American Embassy tomorrow. If she doesn't, she has to start the process all over. So my mother came home and I told her the next day she was bright and early at the American Embassy in Rio.

[00:12:03] And I think that was about June. And in November we came. Because by that time, the background investigation on all four of us, I mean, what crime could I have at two years old? Right. And my brother at five and a half. But a background on all four of us. And when that got cleared, we were able to legally immigrate.

[00:12:26] We got cleared to do the medical part, which they check you from head to toe, make sure you don't have any illnesses, any contagious illnesses, any major, like cancer, anything like that. That's going to cost American taxpayers money. And nowadays, what a concept that is, my goodness. Yeah. If only they would get that.

[00:12:51] When it came to, well, how long were you in Yugoslavia before you went to Brazil? Ten months. Ten months. And so then they were, were there a lot of people who made it to Yugoslavia? A lot of people. But the couple that was with us, Fred and Anna, they went to France. And they lived there a few years and then they immigrated to the U.S. Where years later we reconnected. Oh, wow. Yeah. Wow.

[00:13:19] And then you, so you did that, went to Brazil. Basically your childhood memories must be in Brazil then. Totally. Yeah. All of it. I love Brazil. I have very fond memories of Brazil and usually your fondest memories are your childhood memories. And I love Brazil. And then you, you came here, but you went back. How many times have you been back to Hungary?

[00:13:49] Several times. I have been back several times, especially after they were no longer a communist country because they, the Soviet Union left in, I think, October of 89. And that's a remarkable year because that's when my youngest daughter was born in 89. And I said, this is great. Hungary is free. But I went back many times to visit family.

[00:14:16] My husband had a police chief conference in Budapest one time. So we went for that and made it an extended vacation visiting family. So it was nice. And when you went back, you were still communist when you went back a few times, right? Yes. What was that like as you saw it firsthand? You know, like I said, it was, it looked so depressing.

[00:14:43] And my uncle, my father's brother, was an engineer. Years later, he asked me, how did you, what was your first impression when you first came to Hungary? And I said, I don't want to offend you, but it was very depressing. Everything was gray. Everything was dark and bullet holes in the buildings in Budapest. It was just depressing.

[00:15:07] Cars were gray or dark gray, you know, unless you were in the government, you had a black car, you know, a Mercedes or something. But it was just drab. It was just depressing. It was like oppressed. It was not a happy place. And, and it totally different way of lifestyle. And I knew then I would never, I could never live there. No.

[00:15:36] Well, I can't even imagine because you had been in Brazil and then in America. That would be very hard to leave. Very difficult. Very different. Can I go back for just a second? You said your parents left with a suitcase. The second time, did they also have a suitcase or not? They just had one suitcase with a few clothing so we can change. And that was about it. And so basically the clothes on your back and maybe an extra outfit. What, what did they have before they left?

[00:16:05] What was life like for them before that? And also what about, what was like, life like for your grandparents before? Oh, I want to share something with you. My parents lived a very good life there. They had a house for their own, which was very uncommon. The government, the communist government would have to say, put, put your name on the list. And when we have an opening, we'll give you a house.

[00:16:30] So my parents had a house and I forget how many bedrooms. There they count each room as, as a room. So the living room is room one, bedroom or room two, you know, like that. So I think it was four, five rooms. And they had it fully furnished. They, my mother had a very, very good job. My father was a cabinet maker, a very skilled cabinet maker.

[00:16:57] And so they had a very comfortable life because both of them worked. But before they left, what broke the camel's back for my parents was the communist party put a woman to live in my parents' home. And a total stranger. My parents had two children and my father and my mother. So they put this strange woman to live in my parents' home. And my mother said, no, this is my house.

[00:17:27] She goes, you want me to take your house? She's going to stay here. And they were devastated that now they have this total stranger living in their house. And at one time, my mother came home from work. My mother's kitchen table was moved to the side and the woman put her table there. And she goes, what are you doing? She goes, do you want me to report you? So they couldn't say anything in their own house because that woman was protected by the communist party.

[00:17:55] And I think that probably gave my parents the incentive to just get out of there because this wasn't going to work. That's free housing for you. Yes, there you go. Wow. And then how many aunts and uncles did you have? How many people were they leaving behind, family members? My mother had, I think, five brothers and one sister. Wow. And her mother.

[00:18:22] And I couldn't for the life in me imagine leaving my mother and not saying goodbye. But they couldn't because my mother said she never told her mother goodbye because she was afraid that her mother would stop her by reporting her. So they never said goodbye. And then my father had a brother and a sister and his mother.

[00:18:48] So they left everything behind, all their belongings, everything. My mother had a little box, a wooden box that my father made that she had a couple of jewelry in there. In fact, they gave me a ruby earring, but they had to take it out because my ear kept getting infected. And they put it in this little box and somebody in the family took the boxes.

[00:19:15] The next day they knew that we had escaped. And so they went to the house and cleaned out everything. And I wanted that box so bad, you know. And just recently, about five years ago, my cousin, my father's sister's daughter gave me the box. Wow. My father made. Did your mom see her mother again?

[00:19:45] No. Was she able to communicate with her mommy? They wrote letters. And if they could call, they would write a letter and say, go to the post office. That's the only place there was a phone. I will call you at such and such time at the post office. So they would have to go to the post office and wait until that call came in, international call came in. But there was no direct communication.

[00:20:12] And my grandmother, my mother had emergency surgery, I believe in 65 or 66. And that's when her mother passed away. So she never got to see her mother again. And you went back in the 70s. So you never saw. I never met my maternal grandparents. But I'll tell you, it's the very first thing I do when I go to Hungary. Usually I arrive late afternoon.

[00:20:40] The next day, I go to all the cemeteries to take them flower and say hello. That is every year that I go, that is the first thing I do. When you did that and you found out about your little sister, what did that mean to your mom being able to go back and visit your grandparents' graves and your sister? I think my mother lived through me through that.

[00:21:07] Because after I went in 77, two years later, my parents returned for the first time. And it was still a communist country. But I think she lived through me to experience that and telling me how it was when she was a young girl and growing up and stuff.

[00:21:33] So she couldn't wait for me to come back and show her pictures and stuff. And like I said, two years later, they went back. We have, let me ask one more thing about this that you mentioned. You said your father was considered an anti-communist and he had been speaking out and he was afraid he'd be arrested.

[00:22:03] Do you know the kind of things he was saying about communism? That I don't know. Okay. My father never spoke about it. Never. My father was a very quiet man. And now looking back that he's gone, he suffered a lot. And I remember when we lived in Rio, in Copacabana on the seventh floor. And I don't know what happened.

[00:22:27] And looking back, I think it was when my baby sister, Clara, died. Because downstairs across the street, there was a bar and he went there with his friends. And my father got so drunk. So drunk. And I remember him coming back and him crying. And my mother saying, Giga, Giga, what's the matter? What's the matter?

[00:22:55] And he pulled a chair to the window and had one leg out the window. He was ready to jump. And my mother's pleading with him, please don't do that. Please don't do. And I went up to him and I said, Daddy, I said, please don't do that. Please come here. Give me a hug. Again, he crawled back. And I think he, in putting the two together, I think that's when my baby sister died. Because by that time, they had three kids that had died.

[00:23:20] Well, and day-to-day life for them, they lived under freedom. What was Hungary like before communism took over? Do you know? What was their life like before and what was it like after? Oh, my mother said they had a great life. My grandfather would take the kids to Margaret Island to go skiing, to go roller skating, to go swimming. Sunday was my grandmother's day.

[00:23:50] He took my grandmother out to lunch and then to a movie. That was their Sunday plans every Sunday. He took his wife out, my grandmother. And Saturday was the kids. I mean, there were seven of them. You know, he took charge of the kids and took them down to the bulletin to go swimming, rowing.

[00:24:14] I mean, they had a lot of things that they did that probably under communism, it was taken away. And there were very long lines pretty quickly after this happened. And as we were researching for this, one of my colleagues sent a New York Times, a couple of New York Times articles. And we can put one up on the screen. It's not a lot.

[00:24:41] But the New York Times was, this is in, what year was this? This was in the year 1950. That the food shortages in Hungary were making it to the New York Times. Yes.

[00:25:05] It was my mother mentioned about that many times, how they oftentimes went to bed hungry because there was nothing to eat. And if they had salt, they would exchange with a neighbor who had flour, anything they could exchange, they did. And if you had a pig, you had to butcher the pig.

[00:25:29] But then if the communists found out you butchered the pig and didn't give it to them, oh, you'd be severely, severely punished. So everything you had and owned had to be turned into the communist party. They ate well. They had a good life. But you and your family, they didn't care. No. They didn't care at all.

[00:25:49] And my mother said the lines, they would get up very early to stand in line and freezing, freezing cold and snow up to your ankles just to pick up a loaf of bread or pick up milk. And that was very limited. They said they give one liter of milk if you had three children. One liter of milk for three children, that's nothing. This is half a liter. Yeah.

[00:26:17] So two of this for three kids a day, that's nothing. No. And it's not like you could, okay, can I have six bottles for six days? No. Every day you have to go and get some. This is from May 28th of 1950. Five refugees reported that all milk products have disappeared completely from Budapest. Veal, beef and pork, which a few months ago filled the store windows or as rare as eggs.

[00:26:47] And then in that article that we had from the New York Times, if we can pull that back up, supplies of meat, milk and butter were said to have been about 30 percent below normal since the beginning of July. While potatoes, vegetables and even fruit, which should have been plentiful at this season, were hard to find. The price of butter had raised 30 percent. Long queues appeared in front of the food stores.

[00:27:15] And they tried to say that it was because hungry was exporting excessive quantities of food to pay for imports of machinery for her five-year plan. So the five-year plan was willing to sacrifice food for the current generation right there in that day. And many people, I'm sure, lost their lives to malnutrition and died of hunger, basically.

[00:27:43] And I've never heard of the wood rickets. That's what my baby sister, the first one that passed away, died from. And why? Because, you know, if a pregnant woman is not having any nutrients to provide for herself, her body that's getting depleted to help the fetus survive, then the fetus is not going to have anything either. Right.

[00:28:11] And if you're not getting enough... Funny story. I... Well, I had twins, so that part is not funny. But I was pregnant to 38 and a half weeks, so they were very large. And at the end of the pregnancy, I was drinking a gallon of milk every day and a half. A gallon of milk. And I was feeding two. I wasn't feeding one. So it was two.

[00:28:41] And probably my body needed the calcium as well. I don't know what all was going on in my body. My doctor said, if you are... Your body will make sure you don't starve your babies. Just eat when it's telling you to. And I could not get enough milk. Like, I don't drink that much milk every day. I'm not opposed to milk. But when I was pregnant, I'd have so much milk. Well, imagine if you went to the store and you're pregnant and you're in the eighth or ninth month.

[00:29:09] And you need that to take care of your own bones and your baby's bones. And you get two bottles. And that... And you only get what the government says you're allowed to have. Exactly. And even that, I'll tell you, when I was born, it was against the law in Hungary to baptize a baby. Tell me about that. Yeah, it was against the law. And I thought, what is it to the communist party? How evil are they?

[00:29:36] And disgusting that they say a baby cannot be baptized. And so my grandparents arranged with the church. The name of the city is good. It's spelled G-O-D with two dots on the top. So I was baptized at the church in good. But my godparents took me through the back of the church. But my parents weren't there because four people showing up at a church with an infant is a dead giveaway. Right?

[00:30:04] So they took me in, had me baptized. And I share this. My middle name is Judith. I don't like my middle name. And my godmother is the one that gave me the name Judith. And I thought, oh, my God, what was she thinking? But anyways, God bless her. I never met her, actually. I never met my godfather.

[00:30:27] But then my mother had to get her coupon, her ticket to buy meat because the government told you how much you could have. If they said, okay, you're a family of three, two adults and a child because a baby doesn't eat meat. You can have one pound of meat a week. Pretty much a steak is one pound. Yeah. So that's what you can have.

[00:30:54] So my mother's coworkers gave her their voucher so she could fix a luncheon for my baptism. And that's how everything was calculated. Everything, they determined how much you needed. It's not, it didn't matter if you're elderly and you needed extra. Forget that. No. And God forbid if you needed medical, anything medical, you have to bribe the doctors. You have to pay.

[00:31:22] Even nowadays, you pay the doctor, you know, cash, you know, like token money. Yeah. Yeah. And I thought that was really interesting. And it's just so you have the new replacement. You have to wait three, four, five years to get a new replacement. It's absurd. Yeah. Who are these communist people that are so evil, so distorted mentally that they have no respect for life?

[00:31:52] They have no respect for your health, for children's health, for the future. They just didn't care. And my mother would say that oftentimes the communist party, they were so rude to older people, they would knock them down. You know, why do you treat people like that? What's the compassion to be respectful to a frail elderly person? A woman would get attacked, raped.

[00:32:21] You know, it was just disgusting. Well, they have to dehumanize everyone in order to be that brutal. You have to make you because otherwise you are compassionate and you don't want to hurt people. So you have to get the soldiers to the point where they no longer see human beings as other humans. Yeah.

[00:32:46] And I honestly cannot to this day understand how is it that somebody could have a brain so distorted that you have no humanity, no empathy for anybody. Right. For anybody. I just can't comprehend that. But communism is the worst thing that has destroyed many, many lives.

[00:33:09] And even years after communism ended, I noticed immediately after Hungary was no longer a communist country, they were freed. They took down all the statues that represented communism, Stalin's statue. I mean, you know how enormous that statue is?

[00:33:34] I went to a cemetery in Hungary that has all these old communist statues and a little description of the boot came up about this tall like this. I mean, it was enormous. And but everything was in your face. The radio, they controlled what you could hear, how much you could hear. It was always their propaganda.

[00:33:57] And God forbid you had a radio that you put together at home and you could get stationed from outside to here. They said the United States people are starving, that they were dying in the street. There was no food for people. Total lie. Total lie. But that's how they manipulated and brainwashed people to be leaving their agenda.

[00:34:21] And before they took from the rich, they took their mansions because some people had humongous houses, like two, three stories houses. And they took their house. Then they went to the middle class. They took everything that they had. Then they went to the poor and everybody was the same. All poor with nothing. You had nothing, nothing left because they took it all. And they still took anyway. And they still took it all.

[00:34:46] Because your mother wound up not having, she didn't even have food to give for the, for the, or to have for the party. Exactly. But despite all of that, there is something innately good about many humans that they, they showed, they gave the little bit that they had to your mom for the. Yes. Yes. They were all friends. They went to school together. They knew each other.

[00:35:13] So they kind of helped each other out, which was a very beautiful gesture, actually. But, you know, when you look at some of the elderly people and you look in their eyes and you see no life in their life, it's like their soul got sucked out from their, from their heart, from their mind, from their body because of the evil of communism. And it truly is evil.

[00:35:40] If Americans would only know how evil it is. And I want to say that for the past 10 years, I have personally noticed which direction our country is going to. And it seems like now with the guy in New York, I don't even want to give him the honor of mentioning his name.

[00:36:05] The Democratic Socialists of America. The Democrat Party seems to me they have always been socialist, but they just eliminated their words so they can brainwash and, and pull people in. But I think their agenda is out in the open now. And people need to wake up to that, that United States is changing. Remember what Obama said? I'm going to fundamentally change the United States.

[00:36:33] And Jesus, God help us. And I beg every American citizen, young and old, please keep fighting for this country because I don't want to live in a communist country. And trust me, I know nobody wants to live in a communist country if they only knew how bad it is. No, you're, you're exactly right.

[00:36:55] But the lies that they tell to get people to buy into the system are quite alluring. They're there because it makes it seem like it's going to solve all of, of the problems that a person has.

[00:37:14] You know, yesterday you showed on the, on the board about no rent, no medical bills, no health care costs, no health, no this, no that, no that. It sounds very alluring to a young person who has no life experience of earning their living because life has gotten so expensive for them to be able to go out on their own. It sounds very alluring.

[00:37:42] Let me just ask each one of them. How do you think you're going to get everything for free that we all pay for on a daily basis? Electricity, gas, water, everything, rent. How do you think you're going to get it for free? They have to, there was nothing in this world that is free. They, they'll take it from here to put here. They'll take pretty soon.

[00:38:08] Everybody is going to live in total poverty because there was nowhere to take from anymore. And, and for the young people that says, well, socialism is so good because you get a free phone. Yeah. But what you don't remember or don't think about it is the government can shut it down any minute. And the government can track you and listen to you. My goodness. Yes. Your mom was afraid that her mother would turn her in.

[00:38:34] With the phones, especially if they're given to you from the government, you don't even have to worry about someone turning you in. It's just constant surveillance. You know, even now, I mean, you talk, this happened, we joke in my family about this. I was, we were talking about something one day and I opened my phone and the topic was there. And I'm thinking, how would they know? I was, we're talking about this. My older daughter is the one that brought it up. How does the phone know? And it goes, I don't know, but they, they track everything you're doing.

[00:39:03] It's already being done. It's already being done. I just hope to God that people wake up and realize there was nothing free in this world. You need something, you need to apply yourself and work and, and fight for what you want. Number one, go get a good education. Do your own research. And if you can go travel to a communist country for a couple of months and really see how the communist people under the oppression, how they live.

[00:39:32] And then you tell me how good it is. And you actually did that. Not only did you survive communism, but you actually went back, traveled there and saw what it was like. Yes. And I wouldn't want to live in a place like that. Like Cuba, for example, what a beautiful little island. The poverty level on that island, it is absolutely disgusting. Just disgusting.

[00:39:57] And people work all day. They work six days a week to have the basic necessities so they can eat. That's all they have. Their house is peeling. It needs painting. They need a car that's built up already. That's 30 years old, but they're still putting pieces together to make it run because they cannot afford anything because they live under communism.

[00:40:26] Communism gives you nothing. And that's another thing. People say socialism and communism. It's basically the same thing. There's no difference. One word sounds a little easier than the other one. That's about it. But it's the same thing. And one of the things that we've seen is that it seems that it always leads to totalitarianism. Yes.

[00:40:51] The utopia, the imagined better place doesn't ever actually arrive. And instead, it is this tyrannical nightmare. Yes. It doesn't arrive. But they keep saying, coming soon, coming soon. You don't have food, but in five years, we'll have something for you. Oh, no, we're getting some more food. We're getting things are getting better. Things like now. It's a lie. It's a total deception. It's a lie.

[00:41:22] Your parents made sure that you understood and appreciated liberty. It seems today there are a lot of people who are immigrating to our country who who don't understand and appreciate it. What did your parents do differently that may not be happening right now today? My mother worshipped the United States. She worshipped this country. For 20 years, she wanted to come to the United States. And even as a child.

[00:41:53] And when the opportunity arose, I mean, imagine living in Brazil, trying to survive day after day, week after week, month after month, year after year, waiting 13 years to have your dream come true. My mother never gave up. My mother was a force in my family.

[00:42:16] And I get I speak up about this very publicly because to honor my mother, to honor her legacy. Because I've never been political before. What do you think your mom would say to you right now today? She saw you. It's okay.

[00:42:48] Would hug me. And if you would, just say, I'm proud of you. She should be proud. She would be proud. You're doing amazing things because you're standing for liberty and you're standing for freedom and also for the rule of law. Yeah. My mother would be so proud. What about your daughters? Are they proud of you? They are.

[00:43:15] My older daughter had an incident where she told me that she was afraid for my life because I'm out there doing public speaking a lot about this issue. So and by this issue, just to be very clear, and we're going to do a different interview in detail about this issue. But people who are listening to this are going, wait, why would she die talking about communism?

[00:43:43] What we're talking about right now, actually, that you are very public about. You're an angel mom. Yes. Your son was killed by an illegal immigrant. And that's where most of your public platform comes from. So that would be why your daughter is worried about your. Yes. But in that, I also bring up socialism. OK. And my daughter said, I'm just very worried. And I said, why? I said, he the guy got released already. He was sent back to Mexico.

[00:44:13] And I said, why would you be worried? And this was actually the day that Charlie Kirk got shot. That opened a whole new can of worms for me, because that's how my son died of ensanguination. He bled to death. And my mother, my daughter started crying. And she said, I'm worried about you. And I said, why, Stephanie? And she said, there was a lot of crazies out there.

[00:44:41] I'm afraid that somebody's going to kill you, too. And I said, oh, sweetheart, don't think that. Don't think that. I said, but if that happens, I'll be together with Ronald, with my mother, with my father, and my brother, who are in heaven, and the rest of my family. And I'll be your guardian angel. So I'll still fight from up there. That's what I told her. My children shouldn't have to live like that. No, none of our children should have to live like that. Charlie Kirk's children.

[00:45:11] No, exactly. It shouldn't have to get through what they're going through. And for those of us who speak out, all of our children have expressed concern. Yes. All of them. And it's wrong. And we are a free country. We're not like the country that your parents had to escape from, where people would be killed

[00:45:39] just for speaking or be taken away to a forced labor camp just for mentioning communism in their own home because a neighbor might overhear. But when your daughter is afraid and other children are afraid because their parents are speaking out or their family members, their wife or spouse or husband, whoever it might

[00:46:04] be, it has a silencing effect. And many people will go away because they don't want to take that risk. It takes courage. Your parents, it's clear where you got your courage from. Your parents had it in speeds. Yeah. And it's so true. You have to, by not speaking because you're getting intimidated, you're falling into that

[00:46:33] socialism pattern of you don't have a voice. You don't have an opinion. You can't think for yourself. We will tell you what to think. I am not like that. And I'll tell you something interesting. When COVID hit, I ran for Congress in 2020 and COVID hit, so I couldn't go out and publicly speak or anything. And it just got so crazy.

[00:46:59] And my husband said, Agnes, I'm going to, my doctor suggested that I take the shot. And I looked at him and I said, okay. I said, if you take the shot, I said, I respect you for your decision, but do not expect me to take it. And my husband said, why not? And I said, because I'm not going to be brainwashed into taking something that they just came up with poof, just like that, because the vaccine takes a long time.

[00:47:29] And a week later, I asked my husband, I said, he hasn't mentioned anything about going, getting the shot. And I said, Mark, I said, did you get your shot? He goes, no, I did some research and I decided not to. And I said, very smart man. Very smart man. I'm glad. And he did what you want young people to do, get educated and do your own research. Do your own research and think for yourself. Yeah. Think for yourself.

[00:47:56] In fact, when I ran for Congress, there was this young kid that was a student at Cal State San Bernardino. And he called me, but some of the questions that he asked, it wasn't a typical 18-year-old question. He was reading the question in a textbook about forest fires and this and that. And then he asked me, he said, he went into communism. And I said, and you think that's a good thing?

[00:48:25] And he goes, yeah. And I says, where do you get that? And he goes, my professor said, and he's teaching this. And Andre, I think was the kid's name. And I said, can I ask you a question? And I said, did you ever research what your professor or what your teacher is teaching you? And he goes, no, I never thought about it. I says, why don't you do that?

[00:48:51] Because communism is not the little pretty thing that the Democrat Party is putting out. He was a Democrat. And he said he always voted a party line. And I said, why don't you do your research for once and see what exactly, see what you, if your teacher is telling you the truth. And he goes, oh, I never thought about it. And I said, that's the problem. The young generation are taught not to think. Right. And not to do research to find out what is and what isn't.

[00:49:18] Is what he's telling me real or just his biased opinion? And he goes, you know, I really appreciate you taking the time to talk to me. I have always voted down party line, but I'm going to vote for you for Congress. And I said, thank you. I appreciate that. But I'm asking you, do your research always. Don't just take somebody else's word for it. Right. And that's the problem that we have nowadays.

[00:49:49] It is so true. Well, your mother worshipped the United States of America and you clearly love liberty and are willing to stand up for it. Why is it so important to do that? This is the only country in the world that you have the freedom to do anything you want,

[00:50:17] to accomplish anything you want. The United States of America is the greatest country in the world, in the universe. If we don't stand up and protect this country, and this country becomes like the rest of the world, how are we going to be different than anybody else? How are we going to excel?

[00:50:44] We're going to be on the same low level as some and most of the countries on earth. You know, some of them, my gosh, I mean, I can't even imagine how they survive from month to month. Why destroy something that has worked for 250 years, has offered so much? It is the envy of every nation in the world.

[00:51:10] And it's like the whole world is aiming at the United States to just destroy it piece by piece. Let's not allow that. I'm a legal immigrant. I worship this country and I would fight on the front lines. I don't care if I get killed. I would fight for this country. How many young Americans are willing to do that? And you were born here. You should be doing what I'm doing.

[00:51:40] You should be standing up for this country even more than what I am. I don't know if that's possible, but it would be hard. Yeah. But at least try half of what I'm doing. Stand up for your country. Fight for your country. Get an education. Elevate this country. Don't allow it to be dismantled and destroyed.

[00:52:07] I feel that this country, if we don't do something, hopefully not in my lifetime, we're going to become a socialist country. And God forbid that that's going to happen. And you know, I got to say, there was a lot of people that don't like President Trump, but God bless President Trump. He is a businessman. He's an incredibly smart man. He has a heart of gold.

[00:52:35] He's a very humble human being. And he has done an incredible job bringing respect back to the United States. Because under the previous administration, oh my gosh, it was an embarrassment. Four years of absolute embarrassment. Starting with him and then Kamala. It's like, you can't get any worse than that. Well, let's hope not.

[00:53:04] Let's hope not. My gosh. But we need conservative people to stand up. And you know, the funny thing is Democrats have a lot of the same values Republicans have, but they've been so conditioned to vote party line that they just keep putting the checkmark next to the D. And I said, do you ever investigate what a candidate has done for you in your community? Have you ever asked?

[00:53:34] Have you ever called? Does he ever return or she ever returns your call? Because when they're campaigning, their mouths are running a mile a minute. But when they get in office, would they even take your call? And what are the things that they promised? Did they come true with those things? If not, it's time to go. Time for replacement. Because why do you keep electing the same failure time year after year after year? Time to show them that we're not going to tolerate this anymore and vote them off.

[00:54:05] Agnes, I appreciate your time. Thank you so much for standing for liberty. And for everything that you do, you're standing for our secure borders, but you're making sure others understand just how valuable our liberty is and what is at stake and what America could wind up becoming if we don't hold on to it. And all I ask is Americans to be proud of United States. Be proud.

[00:54:36] You got a great country. We got a great country. Let's not allow it to be destroyed. Fight. Fight for this country. Agnes, thank you so much for joining me. Thank you.

[00:55:09] is hosted by Jenny Beth Martin. The Jenny Beth Show is a production of Tea Party Patriots Action. For more information, visit teapartypatriots.org.